Böyle bir şey özellikle zayıf karakterler üzerinde mümkündür. Zayıf karakterse yanlış anlaşılmasın, en cahilinden en eliter veya kendini zeki zanneden insanlar için geçerlidir. Önemli olansa psikoloji yapısıdır çünkü bu yöntem aslen bir BDSM yöntemi değildir, psikolojide bilinen bir beyin yıkamasıdır. Fetişizimle belki bir benzer durumu anlatabiliriz. Ağır ayak fetişisti olan bir kişinin fetişi önceden yaşadığı bir cinsel olay ile bağlıdır ve travmaya yakın bir iz bırakır. Bu insan cinsel temasa girmeden ayak kontağı ile boşalabilir. Herkesin cinsel tercihine saygı duysakta, iyi bir BDSM uygulaması değildir. Eğer bu gelişimin içinde köleye sonunda bu uygulamadan bir ders verilip ‘kurtulma’ yolu gösterilirse diyecek bir şey yoktur.
Ama kaç dominant kişi böyle bir ciddi altyapıya sahiptir acaba?

Açıklayıcı cevabınız için teşekkürler

Şartlandırma ile belli bir (cinsel olamayan) uyarı ile orgasm olmak mümkün. Buna şahit te oldum. Ancak sevgili MDP'nin dediği gibi BDSM ile doğrudan ilgisi oladuğunu sözylemek zor. Ancak şöyle ilişkilendirilebilir. Bir sahip malı ile oyanmak isterken böyle bir yontemi kullanabilir.

Fizyolojik yapıları nedeni ile erkek kölelerde böyle bir şeyi başarmak zor olsa gerek diye düşünüyorum.

Bu konuda yabancı bir kaynaktan alıntı aşağıdadır. İlgilenenlere keyifli okumalar.

MasterfulJ
A TRAINING METHOD USING CONDITIONING
by MasterfulJ over 9 years ago
The method which I have used to gain control of orgasms is primarily based on conditioning with suggestion and high erotic charge being important components. Although I have tried with several women and been successful with two, the perfection of my methods has been developed with my slave/wife “slavegirl” which is described below.

I started by telling the subject while she was very turned on, while fucking or such, that she would reach a point where she would come when I commanded without further stimulation and would be unable to come without my command. I emphasized that this would require no effort on her part but would be a deeply embedded trigger. This was repeated many times as we went along during and after the initial training.

To begin I asked her to always ask for permission before coming. Initially I gave her permission immediately when she asked. Then I started gauging how long she could hold it off and withheld permission until I thought she was about to fail. I made sure that she never failed at this. Then I incorporated stopping stimulation when she asked for permission and withholding permission for a short period before giving permission. Eventually extending this to a minute or so. I also then started gauging when she was close and commanding her to come before she asked and before she hit her peak excitation. If she failed to come on command or came when I had not commanded, rare occurrences, I took responsibility for it and emphasized that she was not to try and do anything. Telling her I had just made a mistake like trying to make her jump further than she could now, but that with further training she would succeed in this. I praised her whether she came or not. If she failed to have an orgasm it was for showing me her true responses so that I could train her. This is very important so that she wouldn’t be trained to just try to please me.

(I should say that one should be very familiar with the subject’s orgasms before doing this. Watch her orgasms in detail. Watch her masturbate to orgasm. Learn the signs of a real orgasm. One of the dangers here is that the subject may deeply desire to please the trainer and this can interfere with the training. I attempt to get around this by knowing her responses in detail and by always praising her.)

The first time she came on command was at a club in LA. We had played and then watched another couple play. Then I tied her on her back with her pussy elevated so her wet thong was very visible. She was very turned on. The other master and I then discussed how turned on she was, etc while standing on either side of her. When it was clear that she was very turned on, I commanded her to come with no physical contact. She immediately had a modest orgasm. During the rest of the evening I had her come on command several more times and these became stronger.

After that evening I started giving her orgasms on command just with slight pleasurable contact. Such things as hugging her for a few seconds and then giving the command, or briefly stroking her breasts or butt. This is still the way to get the strongest, quickest response and I still use it to reinforce her training. Then I moved to surprising her in nonsexual situations. This typically works very well especially if she doesn’t see it coming at all. She describes feeling a flow of energy into her crotch which then expands into an orgasm.

These orgasms have the typical signs of reddening of upper chest and face as well as erection of nipples and violent uncontrolled body contractions which could cause her to fall if I didn’t support her.

Having achieved this, I emphasized her not being able to come without my command. At first she controlled this by holding her breath and tensing up. We had many sessions in which I would take her to very high levels of excitement and then coach her in breathing or use other methods to get her to relax. Eventually she got to where she could go past where she would normally come, reaching higher levels of excitement without coming. After about 4 y of training I commanded her that she could not come but told her she was to try to come by stimulating herself as effectively as she could. She became very excited and acted like a crazed animal trying to get herself to come. When she was unsuccessful she started crying because it scared her.

In the year or so since this was achieved she came once in a dream when she dreamed that I had commanded her to come. A couple of other times when I had her very excited and gave her intense pain to her clit or vagina she came. Recently, however, with continued training in this situation she no longer comes even with that combination without my command.

I want to emphasize that this is not orgasm denial. Before this training she was essentially infinitely orgasmic, able to have back to back orgasms for more than 2 h. With the training she has fewer orgasms, usually “only” a few a day. Sometimes as many as 20 or so if we play. Her orgasms are entirely at my whim and, as I tell her and she repeats, they have only two functions. I give her orgasms only for my pleasure or to deepen her slavery, never just for her pleasure. So what has changed is that she no longer has any control of when she will come or knowledge of when I will command it. I always try to leave her less than satiated.

The training is not complete yet as there are still times when her consciousness intervenes in ways that are not what I want. We’ll consider these later. There are also many other aspects of this training and its effect upon her orgasmic responses and other things will be considered in the future.

I’d like it if others with experience with other methods either describe them here or start their own discussions for their method.

Best,

JJ

« perv 1 2 3 next »Responses (1 - 50 of 113)
NoVAMrWizard
NoVAMrWizard:
I have trained several women to orgasm on command. Here's how:

First, she must learn to orgasm readily. I use a vibrator for this. In our initial sessions, I repeatedly vibrate her to orgasm.

In the second phase, she learns to not orgasm without permission. I vibrate her, making her wait longer and longer, before giving permission to orgasm. I may briefly remove the vibrator, then put it back, in order to draw out the time before her orgasm. Permission is always given in the form of the command "Cum!" preceded by intense eye contact which tells her the command is about to follow. (With one woman, I would also seize the hair on the back of her head.)

In the third phase, she has her first orgasms while not receiving physical stimulation. As in the second phase, I vibrate her with brief periods during which the vibrator is not in contact with her. When she is barely able to hold back, I establish eye contact, remove the vibrator, and give the command. If timed right, she is so excited from being vibrated a moment before that she starts to orgasm. Whether successful or not, I immediately put the vibrator back on her clit. This ensures a good orgasm whether it started while the vibrator was removed or not. This procedure is repeated many times with longer and longer periods of the vibrator withdrawn before the command is given and longer and longer periods after the command before the vibrator is returned.

The third phase eventually morphs into the fourth phase where the vibrator doesn't need to be present at all. I start by turning the vibrator off and setting it down during the periods of removal. I may turn it back on and just bring it near her to pump up her level of excitement. I move from there to just talking about the vibrator, telling her to think about it, imagine it on her clit, before I establish the eye contact and give the command. To help establish the fantasy vibrator, I might briefly touch the real vibrator to her clit while telling her to imagine it.

(I had one girl who developed the need to cross her legs, trying to hold back orgasm, whenever she encountered something making a buzzing sound. I'd have her lie on the floor, spread-eagle, and let her thrash in orgasm when I set a vibrator/electric-toothbrush/etc. on the floor near her.)

By this time, the women I trained needed only the thought of the vibrator and had developed an association between that and the intense eye contact. I would typically say the one word "Slave", to get her to look at me. We'd make eye contact and she'd see the expression on my face, knowing what that meant. She'd feel the non-existent vibrator on her clit and be holding back orgasm by the time I said "Cum!".
over 9 years ago more
MasterfulJ
MasterfulJ:
Mr. Wizard,

Very nice. Another way of using the elements of erotic excitement and conditioning. I hadn't thought of using a virtual vibrator. You also got a dual conditioning. One to the sound of the vibe, and the other to your eye contact/command. And how nice to have her reminded in public. One could use a recording of a common sound and condition to that for real mischief.

I like the idea of conditioning to sound. I've started working on conditioning her to come when she hears my cattle prod, without it being applied to her.

Best, JJ
over 9 years ago more
MasterfulJ
MasterfulJ:
I realized that I started this off saying that a multiorgasmic woman is easiest to train, however, one can still work with those who haven't yet become multiorgasmic. Just use the same sort of conditioning principles. Simplest is just always command her to come when she starts to come. Then have her ask to come and command her to come. Just be 100% consistent and patient and then work with the same principles as those outlined above.

There are vanilla programs for reaching multiorgasmic capacity. One I've used is ESO by the Brauers.

Best,

JJ
over 9 years ago more
Quite
Quite:
Do either of you ever use commands to make women want to cum without physical stimulation? Also about how long (ie how many sessions or orgasm) does each stage take? I'm sure it varies from person to person but I'm just curious about the ball park.

It all sounds Pavalonian, but exciting.
over 9 years ago more
MasterfulJ
MasterfulJ:
Yes, I use commands to make my slave come. Not want to come as you suggested, but come. Many times she does not want to come. And yes without physical stimulation. Although hugging her so that she doesn't fall often allows her to have a longer deeper orgasm.

As far as the training, it initially took about 3 weeks of concerted, everyday effort. We were fucking a lot and she is extremely multiorgasmic so there were a lot of repetitions. However, over the ensuing 5 + years I've kept working on the training and it has become more effective and elicits deeper orgasms. After about 3 y she became unable to come without my command. And I've used it to train her to have erotic responses to a variety of painful stimuli as well. There is always room for further training.

It is conditioning as in Pavlov. People are conditioned by lots of things, but are usually not aware of it.

Best,

JJ
over 9 years ago more
Quite
Quite:
I see. Thanks for the info JJ!
over 9 years ago more
MasterfulJ
MasterfulJ:
Master namoR,

Please update us on your exploits as you go along. I thing that a recounting of how it works for you would be very interesting to everyone here.

Thanks for letting me know.

Best,

JJ
over 9 years ago more
Dominant_J
Dominant_J:
My slave has asked me to train her to cum on command. She is very M.O. She can have a string for 30 to 40 orgasms and want more. (O and she is also a very heavy squirter! another good point in her favor) I have her to a state now that she cannot cum without my key phrase after only a couple of months. she is going to be very easy to train.

We have an LDR so almost all of the training has been via phone. When me meet it is fantastic. We can be walking through a mall and I whisper the key phrase and her knees buckle and she has to grab me for support. No orgasm yet but we are getting close. I figure within a year I will ahve ehr completly trained to the heights I wish.

@JJ is she special? I mean to take the training so quickly?
over 9 years ago more
MasterfulJ
MasterfulJ:
DJ,

Your slave sounds wonderful. While I have not done a careful study of how responsive women are to this approach, I have been married 5 times.:) From my perspective, since she follows your domination she is special. I would say that she clearly wants to please you and trusts you. That is very special. And certainly her MO talents greatly increase the ease of training her.

I'm am interested that you have achieved her being unable to come before achieving coming on command. My experience has been that while a slave may want to please very much and so work hard not to come without permission, the internalization so that no effort is required and orgasm is impossible without command is not easily reached. Your experience shows that just the opposite can be the case. Fascinating! You have a great subject. IMHO

Best,

JJ
over 9 years ago more
Dominant_J
Dominant_J:
Thank you JJ, She is a special sub. (sub meaning bot submissive and subject). I have been Dominant for over 30 years and D/s for over 20 and could never train my last sub/wife. she would have stronger orgasms when I used certain key words, but she could cum on her own and using those key words never did anything outside the bedroom. She was also MO to the extreme. I dunno, lol, guess this one is just easier... I will keep you posted on her progress... I am interested in seeing how far I can take her.
over 9 years ago more
MasterfulJ
MasterfulJ:
Dominant J,

Thinking over your training described here and in other posts, I realized that you seem to be primarily training her so that she cannot come without your command. That is you withold permission/command until she is very excited and then give the command and she has a big orgasm. This is conditioning her to come only on your command, however, its not directed at conditioning her to come on command without preliminary stimulation.

As I've described elsewhere in this group, the method for emphasizing that is to give her the command to come before she is ready. That is first just give her the command just moments before she is ready. Then if that works just keep moving the command forward in time as you sense her state. Doing this you should be able to quickly get her to respond just to your command. Given that she is multiorgasmic, you can do many repetitions in a single session. You could do it on the phone just by having her use a vibe and then gauge from her breathing where she is.

In general I think that a mixture of lots of orgasms and short periods of withholding work best. You might check out my musings on this in the "orgasm management" thread.

Best,

JJ
over 9 years ago more
Taketurns3412
Taketurns3412:
Like Master namoR, I want to thank you for the invitation to this group. My apologies that it got lost in the cracks for awhile, but as the saying goes... better late than never.
Kenn
over 9 years ago more
Taketurns3412
Taketurns3412:
Hypnotherapy has been my mainline, since 1988. The sideline of wedding photography is almost phases out now. The only wedding i did in 2008 was my grandson's when he got back from Iraq for the 2nd time. If your are a person who prays or one of the synonyms for it, feel free to include Andrew, and my wife's 2nd cousin Cory in your supplications to keep our troops safe........................new par... with that out of the way. I must add that my private training of 4, it seems like there were more, is diff in some ways than what I have done "just for fun" in what we call "Bar Shows". On stage, we ask for volunteers to do a comedy hypnosis show in a bar. Those vols, the 1st time do not know what is (pardon my pun) cuming. My grand finale is to have them audition for a porno movie with a chair as their partner. Then close with sitting them on said chair, and shaking their hand (which is the post hypnotic cue for them to orgasm)... so you could say we bring the show to a climax. The number of women I have done this with, I have long since lost count. The vast majority do obediently have a fantastic orgasm. Most get a look of astonishment, cause they really didn't believe it would happen, but it starts just like I said it would. Many give me really dirty looks when I pull my hand away. One said I don't do that except with my husband. Another said, no not in public. (too bad I couldn't get her in private huh)? So in this public case, the extent of the training they get is a post hypnotic sugg that is given just befor the skit(s).
over 9 years ago more
MasterfulJ
MasterfulJ:
rosie,

Thank you so much for letting me know. I'm very I do have a couple more topics to post on using orgasm control for further perversion of the subject.
JJ
over 9 years ago more
Nuahs
Nuahs:
Thank you for your post.

I have been working on this for a while and i have my sub to the point where she will not let herself cum without permission. and have been working with training her in mental bondage. I place her arms in one position and tell her not to move them and even when she cums they are dont budge. I just didnt want to push to hard and have her faulter. she is doing so well now. I think that i will take a few ideas from here and move up her training.

I think due to her will and want to please she will learn well. She is also MO and loves to Cum! i have had her stop in the middle of an orgasm as well...she didnt like that but she was able to.

anyway that you for you input
over 9 years ago more
MasterfulJ
MasterfulJ:
@Nuahs,

Thanks for letting me know you found the info here useful. It sounds as though you are making great progress. On pushing too hard, just always try to stop before you go beyond what she can do and when she does take responsibility yourself for pushing her too far and praise how well she is doing.

She sounds like a perfect subject.

Thanks,

JJ
over 9 years ago more
Nuahs
Nuahs:
Thanks

I am looking forward to her trainning and the progress that I am sure taht she will make. Although the proscess of getting her there is fun too. Nuahs
over 9 years ago more
Nessa88
Nessa88:
Hello Masterfull,

I've read your thread with interest, I am also very interested in orgasm control, and being able to orgasm on command of my Dom... we are currently only looking into things, but I hope we will very soon try it... I'll keep checking here for updates...
I was wondering at the triggers... what are the usual sentences that ppl use ?

Thanks for the help over 9 years ago more
MasterfulJ
MasterfulJ:
VaniV,

Welcome, orgasm control can be very powerful and intimate. Doing it by conditioning does require some time and if you are multiorgasmic that helps a lot. Be sure and let us know how it progresses if you decide to do it.

The commands which I use are given here http://fetlife.com/groups/575/group_posts/6650

There are also threads here on further uses of orgasm control.

Best,

JJ
over 9 years ago more
Nessa88
Nessa88:
Thanks
I was wondering something else... when doing the conditioning, is it important that my Dom should be the one to bring me to orgasm, or is it enough if I do it, with his command ?
over 9 years ago more
MasterfulJ
MasterfulJ:
His command is the essential element not how it is achieved. This can even be done over the phone.

Best,

JJ
over 9 years ago more
M-o-S-S
M-o-S-S:
@Masterfull

You state "when I commanded", have You ever experimented to allow her to cum when other people tell her, or another idea when only other women, or a certain person.
over 9 years ago more
MasterfulJ
MasterfulJ:
@master of sexual I occasionally have attempted to have others command her. I tell her that she will respond to their command, but I have never really done this in a consistent, conditioning sort of way with a particular person. The results have never been very good. She is just so trained to my voice and the steel in it when I command her that a timorous command to come by someone else elicits only a small response.

I think with the proper conditioning regime one could achieve what you suggest,

Best,

JJ
over 9 years ago more
M-o-S-S
M-o-S-S:
thats nice to hear, Long time ago where I played we had a lady trained, she had great "O" from her Master on Command, she was instructed not to cum for any one else, we all tryed to make her cum while she was bound and blindfolded but she wouldn't. The only person her master would let her cum by was the Madam of the house. We would all give her Master crap because her "O" were more intense from Madam then his commands
over 9 years ago more
EagleMaster
EagleMaster:
MasterfulJ and NoVAMrWizard I have enjoyed reading both of your posts just wanted to say that I have trained a couple of subs by having them do kegels and a phrase and after doing the kegels daily several times during each day I set up a time regiment for them to follow over the course of a month and each time they do them they say out loud or to themselves the phrase, it is usually something like, I am submissive my purpous is to cum for my Sir,Master or what ever, when we are together online or inperson I have them doing the kegels and phrase out loud timing giving 5 minutes in between times for a few hours and once they hear my voice over that time they have began cumming on command usually after a few times of them hearing my voice and commanding them to do it some times it can take a longer peroid to do it though. Its taking control of their minds during that time together.

EM
over 9 years ago more
Carrion
Carrion:
I have yet to hear about someone being trained like me! I seem to have been trained 'backwards' to the norm.

I was hogtied and whipped, with no genital contact, then ordered to come, and keep coming every time she told me to, or the whipping would continue (I hadn't really been whipped before, and it was with a beaded necklace, so it was a pretty good threat).

The next day...I realized that I had a problem. Whenever I heard the word "come"...well...

That 'problem' remains to this day. I've actually picked it up in Cree and French as well. Which, living in Saskatchewan, causes more problems than you might think. A surprising number of people know and use the word come in Cree...anyway. Good times.

Anyway. Neither of us were trying for this outcome, and neither of us in fact really realized that it was possible...but both the one who trained me and my wife quite enjoy it!
over 8 years ago more
MasterfulJ
MasterfulJ:
@Felina,

I've been trying to understand how this would work as a training method. Here are my thoughts.

I think that for this to have worked you had to have been very turned on by the whipping or something else in the situation before she gave the command. (An alternative would be that you already knew how to focus your attention and bring yourself off without stimulation but that doesn't seem to be what you are describing.) So that when she gave the command you came.

Once you came in response to the command you were started on a conditioning program because the orgasm became the reward for and the conditioned response to the command. That is, the more you respond to the command the more it is entrained.

It does seem that your training was quite strong and very quick, but I don't think it was backwards. Do you know if your trainer had used this method on other women and if she was successful with them?

I would be surprised if it were generally useful.

Thanks for a really novel contribution!

JJ
over 8 years ago more
Carrion
Carrion:
@MasterfulJ No, she has not used this technique on anyone else, as she has since left the lifestyle (and apparently has stopped being a lesbian, as well).

I can't, in all honesty, remember exactly what lead up to her whipping me and ordering me to come, as it was quite the experience. I do remember that I was quite aroused, as she had never been (and never was again) so rough with me, so that does sound like a reasonable explanation.

Basically, it was sort of a wonderful mistake.
over 8 years ago more
MasterfulJ
MasterfulJ:
Bump
over 8 years ago more
Taketurns3412
Taketurns3412:
Bump?
over 8 years ago more
MasterfulJ
MasterfulJ:
Just bringing this thread back up in the queue since so many new threads seem to bring up questions which are answered here.
over 8 years ago more
DMD
DMD:
Hi all, interesting topic
I learned a bit about Kinesiology, NLP, and hypnosis as part of my martial arts training and had turned it towards kink after seeing a Master from a well known dungeon use a backward counting routing as a trigger in a scene that involved masturbation. Since then I have practiced using visual and physical triggers which seem to work better then verbal for me. Funny thing is being able to use a gesture such as rubbing your own neck as a trigger. My methods aren't perfect, but they have worked for me and I would love any advice or tips from real hypnotists. I am NOT certified in anything, just someone that met some people and read a few books. It would be great if you are into real hypnosis if you could send me resources or tips. The only reason I am sharing this is to get some feedback. Spanks lots!

My basic concept: Physically stimulate the subject and at point of climax "anchor" the emotional and physical state to a verbal and/or physical "trigger." Done with repetition and good timing and usually takes 10 or less sessions. My goal is to cause orgasm or extreme arousal without touching or speaking as well as control what they are aroused by.

Personally I like to "compress" their orgasms rather then "repress."
If their full orgasm is a 10, then we "walk" them up the scale from 0. This can happen over one hour or up to 3 days. Let them get to 3, then back down to 1, then up to 5, then to 3, then 7 to 5,etc. Each time I introduce a bit more of the trigger at the apex. The entire time using verbal suggestion, "can you (pause) feel how warm you are inside, I can (accent)feel(p) your (a)shaking(p) it's (a)uncontrollable (p) isn't it?, it is (a)okay to(p) let it happen, (a)give in to that (p)(a)amazing feeling, Give it to me right now, etc." The pause is a quarter beat and shouldn't be noticeable. The suggestion is "feel how warm you are inside, shaking uncontrollably, this is good for you, let this amazing feeling happen." Always ended with something along the lines of "give to me" so it is always anchored to my presence.
My understanding is that triggers are physical, visual, or verbal and I like to use all three at the same time. Meaning, at point of installation I would use the trigger word, tap/touch trigger point, and make direct eye contact and use a visual such as a wink or a bite of the lip.

To me orgasm CONTROL is far different the DENIAL, which is really abusive. From my studying I have found that denying orgasms can lead to sexual dysfunction and a list of health problems so I do not anchor the orgasm to guilt or negative emotions and always have a clear goal/date&time when the denial phase will end. The point is not stopping the orgasm but rather -delaying and redirecting- the natural trigger to one you control. When I don't allow a sub to orgasm, it is in anticipation of permission to do so. They feel "proud" when they please me and it makes their orgasm ridiculously intense. They almost always squirt from it and get positive affirmation from me. I don't see any benefit from denying orgasm for more then 3 days. At that point it just becomes negative and may break their pussy ;p Better to let them cum and use it as basis for a punishment scene which gives them an other chance to try again. The idea is not to stop the orgasm, but to compress it, store it, and make it stronger, multiplied endlessly, and only released by my command and in my direction.

Still young and learning, any tips welcomed.
Spanks lots!
over 8 years ago more
MasterfulJ
MasterfulJ:
@DMD

Thanks for your response. This group is about conditioning as described in this thread and the about the group writing. There are several hypnosis groups which specialize in what you are asking.
over 8 years ago more
cherrysinblyss
cherrysinblyss:
Masterfulj...... You've brought up some interesting and very effective sounding things . Thanks for putting them out there..
over 8 years ago more
MasterfulJ
MasterfulJ:
Bowline,

It sounds as though you are having success at extending her orgasmic capacity.
It certainly is possible to condition to physical signal/stimulus.

I am concerned that you are having her ask permission to come before she comes.
This makes it harder break the connection between stimulus and orgasm and connect it to your command. It brings her consciousness more into it. You might review those aspects of the training methods described. The way you are doing it connects her orgasm to her arousal and asking for permission. It may be successful at training her to be unable to come without your permission, but it will not be likely to result in her coming on command without being at a high arousal and having asked for permission.

As far as the libido issue, one method that can be used is to have her masturbate to near orgasm in between sex with you. A vibe such as a celebrator can be very helpful here. A bit of orgasm denial with frequent stimulation like this might make a very big difference here. But women do vary a great deal in this.

My slavegirl usually uses a vibe at nap time in the afternoon and we have started edging her when she wakes up as well. This combined with a few days of denial radically increases her already substantial libido.

D/s vs vanilla sex should make do difference. You can use both for conditioning her.
It is more difficult to condition some, but you seem to have made a good start, now you just need to fine tune some things.

Thanks for writing.
over 8 years ago more
incurablefetish
incurablefetish:
You sir, are a shining example of the power of perseverance and hard work. Well done. Thank you for sharing your methodology.
over 7 years ago more
DaddyBishop314
DaddyBishop314:
Thanks for the information, i've been able to do such things by the sound of my voice thru my commands for those seeking release. This conditioning actually makes alot of common sense and I'll def. have to give those methods a try.
over 7 years ago more
ChoirboySadist
ChoirboySadist:
MasterJ, I'd like to know if there is any idea how often this can and cannot be reasonably expected to work.

In other words, how many women are generally predisposed to being able to do this; how many simply cannot for whatever reasons - physical, mental / emotional, etc.; and how many could be trained, but only with a concerted effort?

Thanks.
over 7 years ago more
MasterfulJ
MasterfulJ:
@Choirboy,

Good question but no one has collected the data.
There are some who have trained a number of subjects and they may have some idea.

And I would add that it depends on the female and her emotional responses to the trainer.
The combination of being easily multiorgasmic and eager to follow the trainer's directions is the best combination. I believe that with this combination a very high success rate is possible.

Difficulty reaching orgasm, performance anxiety around orgasm and such should be handled using the vanilla techniques before trying to achieve control.
over 7 years ago more
Nakamura
Nakamura: devilheart
I've attempted this and successful with one female slave. These are the phases.

1. orgasm intensity exploration - trying to find what totally blows her mind. toys, hard sex, emotionally charged sex, etc

2. orgasm control - while using the technique found in #1, I would count down from some number. First at 3, then extending it to 10 in later sessions. Some in rhythm, some out of rhythm. I would let her cum normally.

3. command insertion - while in phase 2, I say a command at the end of the count down while she is peaking in orgasm. While I say the command, I slap her hard or some other piercing stimulus for reinforcement. The focus is on the timing. I always let her reach orgasm.

4. physical weening - the actual act of sex is toned down, but the countdown and command continues. The physical command reinforcement is not done. Eventually, the act of penetration goes to a rub, then to a caress then nothing. each time the command is issued

5. virtual test - issue the command over the phone or chat.

6. in person test - issue the command while watching.

7. maintenance - the newly learned behavior will be extinguished if not used regularly.

Notes:
- it wasn't straight forward. sometimes I had to go back a step or to reinforce the learned response. In regular psychotherapy, the patient needs to be willing to change, however, this wasn't so much as issue for my first time out. She had regarded me as a god by the time I tried this.

- There is a way to circumvent the will but this method would completely destroy the emotional health of the slave. A security blanket of some sort must be in place and the slave's faith in it proven.

- phases 6 and 7 can be swapped depending on how self conscious she is.

- the sticky issue is to remove all barriers from normal to orgasm. Specifically about removing the self awareness or self consciousness. I was able to train a verbal command to remove this as well. It's similar to priming an engine with fuel before ignition.

===
that's my know-how about my experience. Again, I'm not an expert, and my experience might have been a fluke, but it worked for me.
over 7 years ago more
MasterfulJ
MasterfulJ:
@durentu,

I'm glad to hear that your method worked for you, however it is more complex than the method presented in the original post. I think it also runs a greater chance of misfiring in terms of what is conditioned. You do have a good feel for a number of elements.

The countdown unnecessary and might have just conditioned her to that.

I don't understand your distinction between virtual and in person command tests. If she is well conditioned this shouldn't make any difference.

Your statement, "There is a way to circumvent the will but this method would completely destroy the emotional health of the slave. A security blanket of some sort must be in place and the slave's faith in it proven." is a mystery to me.

Proper conditioning does circumvent the will and it does not completely destroy the emotional health of the slave. And I have no idea what you mean by "security blanket."

Are you implying that you have taught her to "think off", that is that when you give a command, she then consciously brings herself off mentally? This is one danger of overly complicated conditioning protocols and is not what is described in the original post.

If it works for you and you are happy with the results that is great, but I'd strongly recommend against others trying to follow your method.
over 7 years ago more
Nakamura
Nakamura: devilheart
@MasterfulJ
thanks for the info and tips. Always looking to be more effective.
over 7 years ago more
HuZband
HuZband:
Hey, all. I have just started training my submissive and I have begun with yours all advice, so thanks in advance for all the great info here. I have started with requiring she asks for orgasm during sex. Then I moved to adding forced masturbation, that is, having her masturbate in front of me, and when she approaches orgasm, she is required to ask permission and wait for my approval. This is where I am with it so far. I will stay at this level until I see her able to hold for approval as long as I require, once she's on the verge.

Any suggestions as to where to take it next? Thanks!
MZ
over 7 years ago more
MasterfulJ
MasterfulJ:
@MZack,

It sounds as though you have made a great start. Thanks for posting.

I would suggest also giving her the command just before she asks if she is well trained to come when you give her permission to come.

Remember your goal is to get to the point where she does not ask, but just responds to your commands. Training too intensively on delaying her orgasms as you may be doing runs the risk of giving her more control and making it harder for her to come as well. In the original description the intent of holding after she asked was for relatively subtle holding for short periods, not attempting to get her to not come indefinitely.

You want to transfer control to you, not teach her to control her own responses as you may be doing.

Good luck and have fun.

JJ
over 7 years ago more
HuZband
HuZband:
Thanks, JJ! I will be cautious of making her hold too long. She is responding very well to having to wait for my command, and she says that my voice is what's most powerful for her in the process. So I'm looking forward to having her able to respond to my voice alone. I do want her to get used to asking permission and cumming on my say-so before I begin to preempt her request. I worry that if I begin giving her the command to cum too early, she will feel inadequate for failing and the training will be reversed. Is this valid do you think?
MZ
over 7 years ago more
MasterfulJ
MasterfulJ:
@MZack,

I think that you will be able rather quickly to judge when she is about to ask and just give her the command literally seconds before she asks, or even as she is asking. Think very subtle moves at first. I wouldn't try to get her firmly trained to asking before you move on. In fact the asking part is really to help you judge her state, and is unnecessary for the conditioning.

As to failure, tell her in advance that she has to do nothing and has no responsibility in this but will eventually come at your command with no effort on her part. Tell her that if she fails to come on command it is your failure in giving her the command in a way that she wasn't prepared for. For my slavegirl it was quite distressing when I misjudged things as she wanted to take responsibility. But I could get her past that with a lot of reassurance. It is another chance to emphasize that she is in your control, you have responsibility for her training and responses.

Good Luck,

JJ
over 7 years ago more
Zotaxan
Zotaxan:
started training someone very close to me for this and decided to read up and join the group Looking forward to achieving commanded orgasms very soon, she is already doing wonderfuly and responding perfectly, we are both enjoying the training
over 7 years ago more
Zotaxan
Zotaxan:
Success, still training for more/better response, but she's has her first-third without physical touch I'm beyond thrilled and looking forward to training her more
over 7 years ago more
MasterfulJ
MasterfulJ:
Zotaxan,

Congratulations!
Now just keep your focus and realize that if you want to, this can be taken much further than just coming on command using conditioning.
over 7 years ago more
_Badviking_
_Badviking_:
I have had great success using an NLP (Neuro Linguistic Programming) style approach to this. Using either voice, touch or situational triggers.
Advantage is that less intimate knowledge of the orgasm of the "subject" is required.
One ties in the orgasm itself to the trigger as it is happening.
Highly recommended.

I am trying your approach next...)

Paylaşım için teşekkürler baya detaylı bir anlatım olmuş

Üstadım,

elinize, gözünüze, dimağınıza sağlık